Tour de France winner Landis gives positive drugs test
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this is truly sad....
now waiting for 2nd test to confirm.
inevitably Armstrong will also be dragged into this since there were so many allegations against him in the past (altho' nvr proven) -
you have to be kidding me... -
It was just announced that he failed his secondary urine test.
It's becoming ominous for Landis now...likelihood is that he will be automatically stripped of his title. -
sports is no longer just sports when there're so much money at stake..
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I think it's a disgrace you're labelling Armstrong in the same bracket as Landis - no man in the history of the sport has ever won 7 Tour de France, nevermind 7 in succession.Originally posted by weiqimun:this is truly sad....
now waiting for 2nd test to confirm.
inevitably Armstrong will also be dragged into this since there were so many allegations against him in the past (altho' nvr proven)
The fact that he was never found guilty - and you've got to remember they're tested ever so frequently after virtually every stage of the Tour - when he was competing just sums up what Armstrong is about(personally, I still regard the rubbish churned out by L'equippe last year about him testing positive in 1999 nothing more than a feeble attempt to derail his credentials) : a great champion.
I mean, how hard is it to prove someone is guilty of doping? It's just a matter of analysing the A sample and if that returns positive, do the same for the B sample - the fact they couldn't find fault with Armstrong for 7 years(that works out to 140 stages and that's just taking those 7 victorious campaigns into account - he'd no doping record even before he won his first Tour de France) already tells a tale on its own.
For me(at least), Armstrong is one of those great athletes I'd rank right up there with the finest I've seen in my time - and I have got no doubts in my mind he ranks right up there with the likes of Roger Federer, Ayrton Senna and Tiger Woods...
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Anyway, Oscar Pereiro is expected to be crowned champion in place of the soon-to-be deposed Landis : http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/cycling/5249116.stm
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doping...match fixing...whats new?
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Ear-biting? When Mike Tyson famously bit off a part of Evander Holyfield's ear and got disqualified...Originally posted by R3SsH|n:doping...match fixing...whats new? -
i am not labelling armstrong a drug cheat. i am merely stating the fact that armstrong has faced (strong) allegations on doing drugs in the past, though never proven. i am a big fan of him and his achievements. the fact landis has proven to be so inadvertantly will drag armstrong in, especially his detractors.Originally posted by walesa:I think it's a disgrace you're labelling Armstrong in the same bracket as Landis - no man in the history of the sport has ever won 7 Tour de France, nevermind 7 in succession.
The fact that he was never found guilty - and you've got to remember they're tested ever so frequently after virtually every stage of the Tour - when he was competing just sums up what Armstrong is about(personally, I still regard the rubbish churned out by L'equippe last year about him testing positive in 1999 nothing more than a feeble attempt to derail his credentials) : a great champion.
I mean, how hard is it to prove someone is guilty of doping? It's just a matter of analysing the A sample and if that returns positive, do the same for the B sample - the fact they couldn't find fault with Armstrong for 7 years(that works out to 140 stages and that's just taking those 7 victorious campaigns into account - he'd no doping record even before he won his first Tour de France) already tells a tale on its own.
For me(at least), Armstrong is one of those great athletes I'd rank right up there with the finest I've seen in my time - and I have got no doubts in my mind he ranks right up there with the likes of Roger Federer, Ayrton Senna and Tiger Woods...
again, with no reference to armstrong, there are many ways to mask or circumvent a drug test, including sabotage. the process is not full proof. for every proven drug cheat, there are many that got away. i know athletes @ the highest level and sports administrators who have inferred this. -
Sometimes, we all wonder whether there is some form of crusade against those great champs. True, sports is becoming a money-spinning enterprise and nowadays, people do whatever it takes to win big.Originally posted by walesa:I think it's a disgrace you're labelling Armstrong in the same bracket as Landis - no man in the history of the sport has ever won 7 Tour de France, nevermind 7 in succession.
The fact that he was never found guilty - and you've got to remember they're tested ever so frequently after virtually every stage of the Tour - when he was competing just sums up what Armstrong is about(personally, I still regard the rubbish churned out by L'equippe last year about him testing positive in 1999 nothing more than a feeble attempt to derail his credentials) : a great champion.
I mean, how hard is it to prove someone is guilty of doping? It's just a matter of analysing the A sample and if that returns positive, do the same for the B sample - the fact they couldn't find fault with Armstrong for 7 years(that works out to 140 stages and that's just taking those 7 victorious campaigns into account - he'd no doping record even before he won his first Tour de France) already tells a tale on its own.
For me(at least), Armstrong is one of those great athletes I'd rank right up there with the finest I've seen in my time - and I have got no doubts in my mind he ranks right up there with the likes of Roger Federer, Ayrton Senna and Tiger Woods...
As a result, we have a 'guilty until proven innocent' mentality in the drug labs and agencies intent on proving that athletes are guilty of doping, even if they may not. It is no longer a question of fair testing but people looking for a smoking gun. -
No disrespect, but there's a very big distinction between the kind of allegations labelled against Landis and Armstrong - Armstrong was never tested positive in the immediate aftermath of the any stage of the Tour. The remotest allegation against him came years after the alleged event was supposed to have taken place. Landis, on the other hand, was tested positive right after he won the Tour de France - I mean, it's not rocket science to figure the allegations against Armstrong were remotely weak and feeble at best and ludicrous at worst; as opposed to Landis' testing positive in the immediate aftermath of the test(the test results - A sample, at least - were released less than a week after Stage 17).Originally posted by weiqimun:i am not labelling armstrong a drug cheat. i am merely stating the fact that armstrong has faced (strong) allegations on doing drugs in the past, though never proven. i am a big fan of him and his achievements. the fact landis has proven to be so inadvertantly will drag armstrong in, especially his detractors.
again, with no reference to armstrong, there are many ways to mask or circumvent a drug test, including sabotage. the process is not full proof. for every proven drug cheat, there are many that got away. i know athletes @ the highest level and sports administrators who have inferred this.
That said, while I'm not going to be drawn into a debate with regards to the integrity of those conducting the doping tests, I think events like that do reaffirm the integrity of other top athletes(in other sports) even more - think along the lines of the Roger Federers and Tiger Woods...